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VOL. VE.
BRITISH PARLIAMENT:
HOUSE OF COMMONS—Mar 22.
DONERAILE covspinacy.—Concluded from our last.
Mr. JEPHSON complained that the hon. and learned
member had, by his sneers at one member and his sarcasms
. at another—by his recrimination ‘of the hoa. member for
Clare, and by giving over the trials, completely carried away
-the house from the point at issue. The only question in dis-
pute was, had the hon. and learned member that deposition
in his possession when he convicted some men which was
sufficicnt to obtain the acquittal of others; and having it in
his possession, or knowing of its existence, did he try to con-
vict men without producing it?. This was the charge made
against him, and he had only met it by saying that the judge
knew of the existeace of that deposition, and approved of
the conduct of the jury... This was no answer at all to the
charge, which, he contended, was left where it was placed
y the hoa. member for Clare.
Lord ALTHORP said he had attended both to the charge
and to the defence, considering that the house was sitting in
its judicial eharacter. The accusation was, that he was in
possession of evidence which he had not produced on the
trial; and this aceusation did not appear to him to have been
..vefuted. At the same time he certainly did not think that
the hon. and learned gentleman deserved to be censured by
. the house for his conduct.. He was quite aware that there
_ had been mucli violent public speaking in Ireland ; and that
the hon. and learned’ member for Clare had made some
speeches in that country: which he [Lord Althorp] regretted
should have been-made. But when that hon. and learned
gentleman had come: forward in so moderate a manner as
that which the house had that night witnessed, it appeared
to him that he ought not to have been so warmly attacked for
what he had said out of the house. Nothing could be more
desirable, than that all exasperation on subjects connected
with Ireland should, if possible, be avoided.
Mr. NORTH said, that bis hon. and learned friend was
compelled by the conduct of the hon. member for Clare to
allude to circumstances which had taken place. If the hon.
member for Clare thought proper to attack individuals under
the’shelter of tavern meetings, the objects of his attacks were
compelled te follow him thither. The bon. member for Clare
ad two modes of treating the subject. He had one tone for
Treland, and another for the’ house. | [lis vehemence was all
on one side of the chanael—his moderation all on the other.
‘The hon. member for Clare complained of being taunted by
his hon. and learned friend. He believed that the hon. and
learned member wished to escape from his pledge to bring
the subject before the house, and but for being taunted he
“would aot have made the motion that night. (Hear, hear,
hear.) The hon. and learned member had made so many
efforts to escape, that until the very moment he rose he doubt-
ed whether he would bring the question forward. "The hon.
member tugged at his sword so long, that he thought he never
would have drawa it from the seabbard At length it was
unsheathed by the assistance of his hon. and learned friend,
and its edge had fallen on the. hon.. member himself. ie
hon. and learned gent. proceeded to review the circumstances
of the trials, and contended that the ‘ Solicitor-General for
Ireland had throughout exercised a sound discretion. He
stated that the document which the Solicitor-Genoral for Ire-
lacd was charged with having withheld was before the judge
rom the commencement of the proceedings. It was the duty
- of the judge to compare the informations with the evidence
of the witnesses, and to point out any discrepancies which
-might exist between them. It would have been improper
and jadecorous if his hon. and learned friend had interfered
with the Judge ia ‘what was his proper province. After the
triumphant reply of his hon. and learned friend, he would not
long trespass ou the attention of the house. . He was the less
inclined to do so, because he was satisfied the charge was not
intended for that house—a tribunal which decided upon the
dictates of a cool and impartial judgment. The charge was
intended for another tribunal—the excited and inflamed pas-
sions of the credulous people, whose lot it had been for so
many centuries to be misled by ambitious demagogues, who
had sought for their own purposes to urge them on -to those
courses ef discontent which proceeded to turbulence and ter-
* minated in blood. (Hear, hear.) ‘That was the tribunal for
which the charge was intended, and that accounted for the
on. member's reluctance to press it inthat house. The hon.
and learned member felt that he was not practising in his
Proper court,—that was not at the bar of that tribunal where
he had held his brief so long with suecess. (Hear.) . That it
Was which had induced the hoa. member to evade the ques-
TRUTH IS POWERFUL,
AND WILL PREVAIL.
NEW-YORK, SATURDAY, JULY 17,
tion so long, by fixing it on one occasion before Easter, on
another after, and sometimes on a Wednesday, in the hope
that there would be no house. .The hon. member's appear-
ance on the different sides of the channel was singularly dif-
erent. In Ireland, his. swelling chest and powerful voice
might induce one to suppose him a full-grown Irish giant.—
That night he appeared like ‘the little tender babe whom he
himself described as lisping the praise of a juryman. In Ire-
Jand he was at the top of his voice, and played the part of
the lion to admiration. In the, House of Commons he as-
sumed the part of Bottom, and adopting the suggestion of his
predecessor in the character, aggravated his voice, and
roared as gently as a sucking dove.”—{Laughter.) - He could
tell the hon. and learned member that such a line of conduct
could no longer be permitted. He must adopt one of two
ways. . He must either bein both countries the violent. dis-
turber and agitator—the same in his Parliamentary office in
Stephen-street as in St. Stephen’s chapel at Westminster, or
he must be a moderate man in both countries.—(Hear.) He
must no longer talk as he had that night, of pouring oil into
the wounds which he had taken every means to inflame in
Treland.—(Cheers.). The hon. member would ‘soon find
throughout the empire, but more particularly in that part
with which he was connected, such a body of resistance to his
double course of conduct as he would be unable to contend
against. There was a manly, kind, and generous feeliog
springing up in Ireland, in spite of the exertions of the hon.
member for Clare, | It was the natural and necessary result
of the wise legislative. measure adopted last year. It would
soon be out of the power of any man to heat up the national
feeling to the temperature of a furnace, merely in order that
a political salamander might find bis proper element.
Mr. HUME rosé with considerable earnestness of manner,
and complained of the pompous and almost insolent speech
of the gentleman who had just sitien down. He was sur-
prised that his speech sbould have been received with cheers
bythe ministers. The hon. and learned member had applied
song epithets to the hon. member for Clare. What mat-
‘ered it whether the hon. member was a big lion, a puny dog,
or any other four-footed animal. (Great laughter.) He
boped the member for Clare would not shape his conduct by
the advice of the hon. and learned member, although he
swelled like the bull and the frog bursting with self-impor-
tance. (Great laughter.) It was quite an irish scene, which
he never expected to behold in that house.’ What a man to
read a lecture! It was like the mewing of a.kitten.—
(Laughter.) The honourable member fur Clare had not yet
lost his teeth. . He could bite still, and when the time should
come he would halleo him on. (A laugh.) Under all the
circumstances of the case, he thought that his honourable and
learned friend had done perfectly right in bringing this subject
distinctly before the house. He had been told. that he was
not a learned gentleman. He thanked God that he was not;
for sure be was; that if he had had in his power a deposition
which would have cleared an individual accused ‘of a capital
charge, he must have laid it before the court, in spite of all
the etiquette to which. learned gentlemen thought it to be
their duty tocontorm, (Cries of “ Hear,” ia which Mr. Do-
herty joined.) Had that been done in this case? Would the
hon. and learned gentleman on the opposite bench getup and
say that it had? (Llear.)” But his hop. and learned friend
the member fer Clare had the audacity, it appeared, to speak
of these transactions out of doors in such language as bis
feelings dictated, and had not repeated bis observations in
that Kouse. ‘4s it to be supposed,” continued the honorable
member, “that because I am a member of parliament, and
chose to go tu the Crown and Anchor Tavern, to make’ ob-
servations there upon the Chancellor ef the Excbequer, or it
may be upon his Majesty's Attorney-Geaeral—is it to be sup
posed, I say, that lam to be compelled to repeat the same
observations here? I say thatif J make use of ubservations
out of doors, let them call me to account for them. 1 admit
that! say many things 10 this house which I should be afraid
to say out of this house, (Hear and a laugh), knowing that
there is such‘a being in existence as an Attorney-General, and
that it is possible for him to find pliant juries. I may be taunt-
ed with cowardice, as 1 have been already, for this declaration.
But my doctrine is, that in these cases discretion is the better
part of valour (laughter); and then how foolish should 1
look, if I were to. find myself laid by the heels in Newgate,
owing to the interposition of the Attorney-General.” (Ilear
and laughter.) He then proceedéd to observe, that the hon-
orable and learned gentleman opposite had not shown either
that good sense for which be [Mr. Hume] gave him credit,
or thatdisposition to let all things. go on smoothly in Ireland,
on which he prided himself so highly, in reading such volumi-
1830. NO. 29.
aman was inclined, from the excitement of the scene, ‘to
speak more freely than prodence warranted, or than’ he
might otherwise be prompted to do. He would, however, «
confess, that in all the extraets which the honourable and
learned gentlemen had read there was not one word which
he should not have been proud to utter—[Cries of No, no]~
with the exception of the last extract, which related to the
sub-letting act... (Hear, hear.] He was suprised: that the
hon. and learned gentleman should have read the extract aiter
the explicit manner in which the hon. member for Clare had
disavowed it. ({fear, hear.] | He could not help considering
that circumstance as a proof how strongly the hon. and learn-
ed gentlemen felt the justice of the observations of his hon.
and learned friend the member for Clare.. [Hear.] He’
thought that it was the bounden ‘duty of every honest man
who thought that a public officer had‘ misconducted himself, .
to state that opinion publicly.’ (Cheers.]) The manuer in
which his hon. and learned friend had been treated was most
illiberal and ugjustifiable. | (I{ear.] : The two hon. and learn-
ed gentlemen had charged his hon. and learned friend with
shrinking, as if he was . afraid. of. ten such—backed by’ the
whole Treasury bench. (Hear, hear.] After the statement
made by his hon. and learned friend, on what ground did the
the hon. and. jgarned gentlemen opposite taunt his hon. and
learned friend with shrinking, as if he were afraid to meet
them ?. For his own part, he {Mr. Hume] ‘confessed that ho
wished he could take the same view of the question as that
which had been taken by the noble lord. He was quite ready
to admit that he did not believe the hon. and learned gentle-
man had acted wittingly and intentionally; bat the fact un-
doubtedly was, that he had withheld from the court circum-
stances of which he was in possession, and which, as soon as
they were produced, occasioned the immediate acquittal of
the accused. On these grounds his hon. and learned friend
was warranted in asking for information.” To bim [Mr.
Hume] it appeared that the character and honour of the hon.
and learned gentleman required that all possible information *
on the subject should be produced. He was willing to concur |
in the censure, but he was willing to have the papers produ-
ced, and to allow the hon. member the benefit of the docu. ”
ments.—[Iear, hear.]°
A conversation, between Mr. Jepson and Mr. Doherty, here
took place across the table, respecting the time when the de-
position of Patrick Daly, oa the 29th April, was first in court;
but Mr. Jephson's remarks were quite inaudible in the gallery,
and Mr. Dougherty’s nearly so. We understood the latter
gentleman to state, that he held ie his hand a certificate of the
clerk of the crown, that the depositions of the 29th of April,
were returned to the proper quarter three months before, that
is, early in August. On the second trial Mr Baron Pennefa-
ther, observing the difference between the witness's deposition
and his oral testimony, called bim [Mr. Doherty] aside to the
bench, and asked him whether that variance had attracted his
notice.—He told the learned judge immediately that it had.
He could not have noticed it to the jury for the reasons as- ©
signed by his honourable and learued friend behind him. He
certainly bad a strong impression on his mind ; it might be a
wrong impression, or it might be a right one ; but be felt that
if he had mentioned it to the court it must have been in a
point of view unfavourable to the prisoner. .
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said that the hon. mem-
ber for Clare, having been engaged for the prisoners, he had
his feelings too rauch influenced on the occasion... The charge
had been made entirely on a mistaken ground, and his learned
friend needed.no defence. No imputation could rest against
a prosecutor for not bringing “forward the depositions taken
before the magistrate, Tor these depositions were often poor, *
meagre, and ansatisfactory, and were superseded by the bet~
ter evidence elicited and cullected by the attorney in drawing
his brief, and in instructing the counsel. It was far from pro-
per in all cases to give evidence to be produced against them,
for such a proceeding would enable them to meet that evi-
dence by eurreptitious means. Butthe hon. member for Clare
had spoken of an intended alteration of the law. Now be
devied that the papers required were requisite for any such
alteration. For instance, the judge’s notes were not public
documents; they were merely taken to refresh the memory, ,
and handed by way of courtesy from one judge to another.
Such notes were not evidence, and there was no example of
their having been produced or called for, and the calling for
them would be disrespectful to the judges. Were his bon.
and learned friead to be impeached before the bar of that ,
house, the notes in question would not be evidence against
him. He should think it his duty to oppose the motion... |
“Mr. D. W. HARVEY’ did ‘not think the great anxiety -
which the hon. and learned gentleman (the Solicitur-Gene-
nous extracts from speeches wade at convivial bards, when
e a’
% Ah
ral for Ireland) exhibited to meet the charges which wero
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