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:Ii)UBI.IN, "s‘ATURDA’Y,‘ -OCTOBER 14, 1922.“
[PRICE TWOPENCE.
‘QUERIES.
PART I.
By Eoin McNeil1.
WHAT year is this? This is the seventh year 1
of the Irish Republic.
VVba.t was the first year of the Irish Republie?
The year 1916-1917.
And the second year? 1917-1918,
And the third year? 1913-1919.
when was the Irish Republic first constituted?
It was established by proclamation on Ilse-ler
Monday, 1916.
Yes; but when was it sciuslly constituted‘? It
wns constituted by Dail Eircann early in 1919.
Then you hold that it existed for nearly three
yegrs belbre it was constituted? Most decidedly
0
Could it exist without being constituted?
Certain] .
And without having any form or machinery of
govamnuent? Yes.
And without any military organisation? Yea.
VVhere did it exist before being constituted by
D2511 Eireann‘! In the hearts of all true Irish
Repuhlienns.
In what did the Irish Republic consist during
that time? In the hdelity of Irishman and Irish-
women to the epublican ide .
Does tlle existence of the Irish Republic de-
pend on a majority of the Irish people being faith-
ful to the Republican ideal? It does not.
e xnsjnrity--or the Irish people at pre'se'l‘.'F'J
-r--Is th
lliithful to the Republican ideal? I believe that
rhe rnajerily of them In their hearts are in favour
of an Irish Republic.
ut is a nlujority -faithful or nut‘? A majority
under duress have accepted the Treaty.
How does the Treaty stand towards the Irish
lepublic? The Treaty is subversive of the Irish
Republic.
Therefore you $11)‘ that the majority under
duress have subverted the Republic? It has not
been put to them as .a clear issue at the elections,
Apart from elections, wlult is the attitude of
tllu majority towards the Republic and the
Treaty? The majority unrler duress acquiesce
in the ' a V.
Therefore they acquiesce in the subversion of
the Republic? It would appear so.
Nevertheless, you say that the Republic still
lives?‘ Yea; I and those who agree with me say
so on every opportunity,
You hold tllllt the Republic could live bcfore
bi-ing wnstitlltcd by the mlljority of thp people.
An Dail.
Shelving the Independent Ministers.
The Privy Council Clause. ,
SHALL we, or shall we not, have Ministers
who are not members of An Dltil? This
ihu principles involved; Tlirase in favour of the
iznlovation-for innovation it is, despite of pre-
owlonrshave enlarged on the obvious, but much
neglected fact that Execlltivo ability is very
often Ilttelly divorced from those qualities which
guin popul. cenlidenee or enthusiasm at the
polls, and that to make those qualities the test
he is fittest to govern who lelut daslrss it) The
opponents of tllp acheme do not attempt t0 rebut
e llrguments. They irnlora them, and ad-
0
urguuienrs oi the eas. A aned Vcl] thn
tho elected men are all fools and knaves; still,
and after being subveried by a. majority of the
people? yes; but it his been subverted under
u .
That nlelkea I (li$erence‘? Of course it makes
a diiference.
Admitting that it does, the fact remains that.
in your view, the Republic existed before it was
constituted, and atill exists alter it has been sub-
verted? ‘It has not been entirely subverted.
minority still remains openly faithful to the Re-
uhli
c.
And by vinue of that fidelity the Republic still
lives? Yes.
The same Republic as before 1919? Yes.
“'5 are quite clear about that? Yes.
You said slrendy that a majority of the Irish
people in their hams hrs in lavuur or an i h
Republic? Yes, in a general way. They are in
they do not Want to set up a new monarchy in
ii. That means that they are virtually
an.
in long have they been in iavuur com
plete independence? Throughout their whole
istory.
How long has there been a minority in Ireland
expressly faithful to the Republican ideal? That
would be hard to say, I believe that Wolfe Tone
was the first to declare expressly in luvbur of an
Irish Republic, There were probably a good
many other Ii-zshnepuhllcans in his time, espe-
cially after the establishment. of the American
Republic and the French Republic.
I ugres with you Wolfe Tene voiced the
mind of many others. What do you think he-
came oi the Republican ideal after their time?
c.rt:-ail: number, I bolieve, continued to be
faithful to it. number increasoil with the
failure of 0'Connell’s Repeal movement, and
became very large with the enl:-In Illovenleni.
nd ever since then there has been It consiilol‘-
able minei-ily of true Republicans, apart from the
general sentiment in Llvour of independence?
I believe so.
If so. the Irish Republic must be in existence
far longer than seven years. ‘es. if you put it
in that why; but I lmlrl that it is tocllnically in
existent-c r-inre the Prm;l.llvmtinn of Eilster, 1915.
It is surprising to inc that you, holding, as
you prerese, the doctrine of s Republic having a
moral existence, apslrt from being can ted by
A mrqority vute and from exercising the functions
of governmnllt, should Attach such importance
lhey are lhe people's choice. whim have we
been sghrlng for all rlicsu yen“? Not for good
government, but lcr sIvlfrgoir:l'nmenL-lor the
light of the people to lmlke a mess Di their evm
naslrs, inst . of hnviug them manllged-well
or otherw '
intellectuals. ' Such are the two cases, and as
iliere is no point of contact between them they
were productive JI muvh stilmll.-sting, if incon-
clusive, vrr.u.g‘ng.
It was otherwise in tho Chamber, where by
lemporsrily accepting lhe principle, an ap-
' g mittee to consider its application,
the Deputies ccnlesserl their inability to grapple
with the problem. Such discussion as there was
indicated thur, the disputhl vfera y no means
<:le.1l' on l’al'lO general prillciples of tlm measure,
and sltogetllur at aen in regura to the details;
iu fact, we more than suspect thllt insny or
them hull given the eluus-s but curscry resding,
Professor Thrift slnne suggested a point that
we had not heard mentioned oucsirle-naniely,
that the appointment ‘of independenl ministers
would obvious the necessity lor permanent cri-
(‘izlls ‘at the heads of their departments, which
would be a welcome eclrnonay, Then; is little
chance that the clause will be left in its original
iorm, for the Committee will probrlbly act as
tall ceninuucce .10, and prnduce a colllpromise.
Deputy Filrgibbon. Chairman of the Comnlittee,
will prollllllly make the most cl his point as to
lIiEeI'E:Dtl8tll‘lg between Ministers and members
of the Executive Council. If he carry the others
with him he muy yet Filvn the best part of the
clause.
The cleui.-u reserving the right 01 declaring
war to the ()ireIu:htaa provoked an amendment
from Mr. Dllrrell Figgia, by which the mutter
l to a technical existence arising out of a particu-
lar public act. Can you explain this? I think
you are trying to lznlllre 3 debating point.
Pardon me, that is exactly what I am trying
to get away n-urn. It is you who hold to the
technicality, which is so wholly at variance
with the moral basis you claim for your posi-
'on, Your main position, as I understand it.
is that the Irish Rcpublic exiata by right, in
virtue of what is in the minds or, as you prefer
to sev, in the hearts at so many Irish people,
is that soi’ Yes.
thoughts, when you my at the sums time that
the Irish Republic begun to exist
191 , and that this is the seventh year of the
Ir h Republic. How c you reconcile the two
nations? I am not concerned with reconciling
them. I am satisiilsd that an Irish Republic
exists because it has a right to exist and that
Irish people, runny or few, mean it to exist
em also aatisiied that an Irish Republic wus
formally established in 1916, even though it
existing Republic arul a formnlly existing Rel
public
Why confuse the two? Show me where I
confuse t em.
‘on say a the Republic was Iormnlly
l‘53i;Hl)liSl)9Ll at Easter, 1916?-Yea.
w ' the Republic no established
‘exist forllmlly‘? Formally, only a rew days.
When did it begin uguln to exist formally ?N
when it was constituted by Dill Iairesnn in
1919
' VJ‘ Betwewl these times, did it exist at all? Yes,
it existed by right and in the purpose or those
[Who are faithful to it.
. That was a moral existence? I suppose ao.
v So, when you say that this is the seventh
ear of the Republic, you are eenlusing nwrlll
with formnl existezlnn, and adding tha two to-
gether? That is a tinordrawn argument.
r If so, Wily do you insist on the importance or
‘he eevrruli year? I am entitled to do so
And i is you w 0 make u point about the
Republic not being MI issue at the lust elections?
I insist on .
ml insist on tho theoretical Rnpllblie when
it suits voii, an on the tonne of political pro.
cad-Ire Vi l!(‘!l it suits yml? I am entit ed to do sn.
Do ynu hope that lhis duplex attitude will
pass eitlmr for sincere idealism, or or onest
preclieul pulitica7 I decline to answer a question
ilnplying M persona mlcusa ion.
very gorxl. The answer, vnlll ull its implica-
' ]llite obvious.
(Part 11. nezt work.)
would be made the sulneel bl e lzeterenduni.
speslrsrs rr-tel-rllia o the action or Mr. 1 ed
l'l “ up ds " ' might-have-beens,'
, Whether the contention of Mr. Figgls is sound
l or not. 110 has not, on his own nuulogy, found
I the relllllily; for in 1914 the bulk of the people
‘ definitely supported Mr. Redmond.
V
swallow the rncnnrchisl gnllt were entirely p!‘B)se-
worthy, but really they ought to have strained as
this csrncl. Mr. ' ytilo said cherc was no use in
lnnking highhiluiln speeches about us Irish in.
tarpretatiml. Deleting his adjeciivu (which begs
the qlleiitiun) we venture to insist Lllllt there is
every use in rnslxing it. quite clellr mint we shall
alwa a put an Irish interpretation on every
prctation we shall put on the particular clause
ere concerned assuming, on the British
iinnlugy, tllllt His lliujoaty only acts on the ad.
vice of the Irish lllioislry) is this:-
" Nothing in this Constitution ahllll impair
the right of any person to petition his Majesty
(LL, the Irish Executive) for special leave M1
in Council, or the right of his Mlljcaty (l'.a., the
Irish Executive) to grant such lelwo.”
The Work Ahead.
Making Liberty 3. Reality 1
During the winter of 1920, when hope lay
prostriuc, and only the undimmed eyes of the
bravest saw the vision ct an Ireland ungnr.
rlsoned by English troops, e few undaunted snuls
on a ying column began diacuasinar u
their camp ‘tires the meaning of this Free Ire
tland was iree, an was Glxnagow
their dream city? 'ould the metropolis of llielr
h-as Ireland continue to
a course, and never woulll they lay (lown
their arms if their Free Ireland were to be the
happy hunlinggreund of use sweater, the Jew
financier, and the vampire prof-iteer.
A Small Band.
A message from this column reached I. small’
band of students in this city, who, spurred by
their earnest sulicitations, went at once to Work
Realising that the key to the position as srcn
ares lay in the econolznic r l
IHQSEIWQ was delivemd produced -' An Economic
Progvluhme for the Irish Free State" (Talbot-
Press. (id.l. h the origin of the booklet
aded notice in the Irish
Press. nevertheless, it is aubmitti-.11 that the prin-
ciples laid down in that booklet are the l.lBCf‘Fl>‘lIl’y
founrl-l ‘ons upon which the superstructure er a
. rllxnul must bu raised.
A National Duty.
Assiirningsnuh is very rneh ussuniplien-i.lu.r
the purpose for which Iriabmen are associated ill
posl 10!] to enjoy liberty and pursue happiness.
11, however, the ilr-lermining rnlljority of Irish.
msn um rocure for themselves fond, clotllillg,
and shnlter only by the penniasinn of a forcilzn
blm' r nnlzlcicr, if they are dependent for
the satisfaction of thnse indispcusilsle fumin-
nlentul needs upon the will of another, if tllvy
have lo surrender their wills mid silbordin.-lie
their powers of initiative in order to secure tluvae
things, then esn Irlshnien in no sense he cm1<
sidered free men. Accordingly. the first, the pum-
mount llutj; of the Irish Free State is to sccurn
o
erm m
use of rzilience and invention this food, cothing,
and shelter should be secured with the minimum
cullnnil, spiritual, and humanistic ends.
urh ' our social problem. Can Irishnwn
solve in
can it 55 Dane.
rier to its solution ,
Within reasonable limits the requirements of the
community calling itself the Irish Free State in
terms of food, clothes, and houses. The statistics
of the Registrar-Gnneral, the n‘tuI'ns of the
Board of Trade and the Board of Customs will,
on eriunination. ul cwing for the necessnlry
' ' ta.
gramme of production we may mzk ourselves if
the nccornplisllment of such n pregrsrnnie
supply the 'undumrntsl material requirernenie
oi the Irish people wcula not be the first mm of
snv community with a claim to suniry. Is the
prcgwariime ieselb e.
BEN EDAIR.
(Tn lla continued.)