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TRUTH IS POWERFUL,
POWs Dithe
RNA,
“CATHOLIC ASSOCIATION,
FOURTEEN DAYS’ MEETING,
_o.. HUGH O'CONNOR, Esq. in the Chair,
- °° Mr, O'CONNELL said he had looked into the address from
the friends of civil and religious liberty in. Washington, and he
felt great pleasure in stating that he could see nothing objec-
tionable in it. It was an address not from,any body, but from
a number of individuals, and their reply would be intended for
those individuals... ‘heir reply would be directed to the Chair.
man ofthe meeting. | In the phraseology of that letter the body
~ might be implicate¢. There was no, difference of opinion as
to detailing in that letver the unanimous gratitude of the Catho-
Jics of Ireland for the sympathy expressed towards them, “But
le was sure that Mr. O'Gorman Mabon, who presided at their
» “;meeting, and whose duty tt would be to return an answer to
this address, wouid ot-deem it disrespectful in bim’ (Mr.
_ O'Connell) tosuggest that that reply should be submitted to the
standing Committee. ‘Ybe rale of the Old Association was,
no answer shuuld be returned to’ any document without being
submitied to the standing Committee, On one or two occasions
that rule had been neglected, and the: had no reason to re-
joice at the omission. Mr, O’Couueli then moved that_the
Yeply 16 be forwarded on this occasion shall be submitted to the
a ~ standing Commitee. . .
Mr. LAWLESS expressed his surprise at this proposition ;
it was the first time he had seen Mr, O'Connell tyeat the deci-
sion of a ineeting with disrespect,
«Mr. O'CONNELL meant the most perfect respect to the
‘decision of a meeting, The resolution had been passed—the
‘only question now was to the form of the reply. Votes of
thanks passed at the Olu Association have been transmitted io
“tetters which were afterwards read in the House of Commons
avainst the Catholic Body. It was for that reason that a reso-
. lution was passed by the Old Association, that no letter should
~ , be transmitted in the name of the body, that had. not been
sanctioned by the Committee, fe only suggested that this
wise and proper course should be adopted on this o¢casion —
Suppose a letter was transmitted, and in making the supposi-
vion (he of course meant no disrespect to Mr. Mahon) which,
“amongst other things, said, Lam happy to tell you we are going
“to war, It was possible, though not at all probable that such
phraseology would be used, but it was to guard against even
‘the possibility of coramitting' the body, that the, form, of an
euswer should be approved of by a Committee. .
Mr. O'GORMAN MAMION said it had been agreed that the
yote of thanks should be transmitted tbrough the Chairman,
lie fully coucurred iu the principle aid down by. Mr. O’Con-
~ yell, that no document respecting the feelings of the Catholics
‘should be Wansmitted, without being submitied toa Committee,
He regretted that suca a principle had not been ugiformly ad-
hered to.
Mr. O'CONNELL moved that Mr. O'Gorman Mahon be re-
ry “quested to transmit their reply. : .!
‘The motion was seconded by Mr. Coppinger, and carried.
Mr. O'CONNELL rose to make a motion to which he anti-
cipation no objection, Lt referred to a pudlic newspaper, the
. "Morning Post, ia which the advertisements of the Catholic
Dody had been formerly inserted, but by a decision of the Fi-
wance Committee their advertisements were withdrawn from
that paper, ‘The Proprietor was now na more, Ue had left a
wife and family whose principal support he (Mr. O’Conuell)
“believed was this paper, He would therefore move, that the
advertisement of the body be ordered , fo? insertion’ in, that
this motion was deferred, The late Proprietor of that paper
was his friend, and he could say that that gentleman never eu-
wrtained the least personal maligaity towards Mr. O'Connell,
As toany personal eflections which might have been made he
(Mr Dwyer) did not stand to justify them. That gentlewan’s
heart he could say, beat warmly in the cause of Ireland,
Mr. OU CONNELL would defer the motion till the next day,
+ ia consequence of what had fall from Mr. Dwyer. The adver-
tisements were diseontinued in that. paper by the Finance
{ Committee at the very period, and the, only one whew its late
“SProprietor, agreed in opinion with him (Mr, O’Connell.) It
‘Was a mistake to suppose then, that it was any thing personal
*
4
“that occasioned the withdrawal of the advertisements,
OSs DINNER TO MR. DAWSON, .
i ¢ » Mr. O'CONNELL said, in moving that a dinner be given to
{ the patriotic Member for Louth his object was two-fold. He
tH was glad to pay an old and esteemed friend. a personal compli-
7 - anent; and he was actuated by a higher motive—to pay a com-
a ; pliment to him who was emphatically the representative of the
‘people. Perhaps in Ireland there was not a member who was
anore distinguished as the real representative of the people,
paper. . . :
hoe “Mr. JAMES DWYER thought it would be more delicate if | 8!
Caw eYOBE, SALURDAY, ABRBING To USB.
timable value of the principle of the elective franchise. It was
agreat and glorious triumph for Louth, aad he hoped that that
County would possess an additional claim to their respect and
admiration, and now that it had dismissed one intolerant mem-
ber, would send the other after... Mr. O'Connell moved, that
it be referred to the standing Committee to make the necessary
arrangements for a public dinner to-Mr. Dawson, #8 a testimo-
ny of respect for that gentleman, and to celebrate the triumph
of purity.of election in the County of Louth, .°
Mr, O'GORMAN MAHON seconded the resolution, |,
Mr, DILLON would not oppose it, but he ¥ould,,as Mr.
Sheil had.done before, express his disepprobation of the sen-
timents that have come irom.Mr,. Dawson respecting Church
and State.
Mr, O°GORMAN MAHON said, that the words used by Mr.
Dawson, in his letter were, that he would support Church and
State according to the genuine principles of the constitution—
(hear.) Was there any one in this room to object to such prin-
ciples (cheers.) ‘
Mr, JAMES DWYER knew Mr. Skeil too well to suppose
he would found, as had been stated by Mr. Dillon, any, serious |
charge upon what might eccur during the hilarity of a_public |
entertainment, Mr. Sheil should be the fast mau to rest a
charge upon véhat had taken place at.a dinner. Mr. O'Connell
had very properly .explained, at the last Aggregate Meeting,
the meaning of Mr, Dawson, and defended his santiments.
SiR EDWARD BELLEW had received a letier from Mr.
Dawson, written after he had perused the discussion on his
letter. Mr. Dawson stated, that his sentipents had been mis-
understood, and that their real and true sense was, that given
to them by Mr. O’Connell,
The question was then put and carried.’
PENSIONING OF THE CLERGY..
Mr. LAWLESS rose to move upon his notice on this subject.
He did not mean to underrate the importance of the exertious
and political independence displayed by the forty shilling free
holders Jast year, but what would they have been only tor the
Priesthood? He did think that their independence, and their
honesty, in a great measure, depended on the purity, integrity,
and high character of the Catholic Clergy. They all knew the
wholesome controul, the salutary influence which the Catholic
Clergy exercised over these honest men. It was by their ex-
ertions that the, proud triumph of Dawson, in Louth, was se-
ured. He did not mean to detract from the merits of the forty
shilling freeholders, but he was bound to say, that the result of
the late elections would not have. been.s0 slorious but for the
exertions of the Catholic Clergy.. They: cd-operated with the
people, and secured the triumph of the country, . Ele would
be the last man to bring forward the proposition which he was
about to submit to them,’ if he conceived that it in the least cast
any impatation ou -the purity and integrity of the Catholic
Clergy. But he was for calling forth the laity to support their
Clergy. - If this were merely a spiritual question, then; indeed,
the laity sheuld not interfere. But it was equally a political
question, aud vitally affected the interests of the Catholic laity.
He would be the last man to allow a Clergyman to interfere in
his temporal concerns, There was a time, and that not remote,
when the Clergy looked for the co-operation of the Jaity on
this question. {eafluded to the introduction of the Clerical
Wing in 1825. The Catholic Clergy were then silent, by rea-
son of the silence of the Jaity. What did Br. Doyle say thea?
“J would not have it supposed (said that great Prelate,) that {
should stand as a bar against the emanctpadon of my Catholic
Countrymen.” Dr, Doyle, though he would never consent to |
thé measure, did not oppose it, because the laity were silent,
Mr. Lawless concluded by moving, that.as no- nytice bas been
ven in Parliament of the intended introdaction of any mea-
sure for pensioning che Catholic Clergy, the Irish people did
not consider it necessary to come to any. resolution on the sub-
ject at presgnt. + : °
This motion having excited the laughter of some, Mr. Law-
Jew said, he would come to the poiat.at once. He accordingly
moved that it.be referred to a Commnittce to prepare a petition
against any measure for -pensioning the Catholic Clergy of
Ireland. : - ‘
Mr. REDMOND seconded the motion. .
‘The Rev. Mr. LESTRANGE said he was not a little sur-
prised at the first resolution proposed by Mr, Lawless, a reso-
lution which in fact said nothing. He felt it his duty to object
to the resolution proposed. ‘This was nut a proper time to med-
die in the question. He would not say if the time had arrived
that it would then be improper for the laity tyadopt sucha reso-
lution.» The motion was at present quite Gnovcessary, He
would ask why those gentlemen whe had professed so ardent a
love for liberty, and who were opposed, so strongly opposed to
the frechold wing, had allowed six: months of persecution
against the freeholders to pass by, without meeting to express
their thanks to that noble body of men, and tu contribute to
their support? . Yet these gentlemen wanted them now to adopt
# ~than Mr. Dawson. He had been returned to Parliament free
of expense. He did not buy the people,'and even if he did,
. he would be incapable of selling them, He was a faithful and
Honest sepresentative, Lis election convinced all of the ines-
i ra
a resolution respecting the pensioning of the Clergy, a resolution
that was’ perfectly uncalled for. He alluded to the patish of
St. Andrews. He would ask Mr. Lawless—suppose, for a mo-
AND WILL PREVAIL, °
Os La
‘
‘in what situation wouldthe body be, placed? Had the laity
such a right to controul them? Are the clergy free agents it’
this resolution be passed?’ ‘The Catholic Clergy -have fought
the battles of the laity in times of trouble and danger, and .
would the people’ now say that they are not to be trusted ?—
This resolution went to say that the laity were afraid thai the
Clergy would not act on this question, as they had bitherto
done, _ Are the laity ready:to suppose that the Clergy would
not resist any such measure? Bat even. supposing a bill to -
that effect were to pass, it is an indulgence, and no one can be
compelled to accept an indulgence. A second party must be <
consulted. Who would oblige them to go to the ‘freasury 7—
If the public. sentiment were declared as it, would be on the
subject, what Clergyman would dare that opinion, He could
not see the propriety of interfering on the present occasion. —
All with whom be had conversed on the subjeét, agreed that
this was not the time:to introduce such a proposition. Ue
begged Mr. ' Lawless to withdraw it. [Je put it to his good
sense whether it would be proper to excite division samungst
them at this critical moment. He (Mr. L’Estrange) would not -
surely be acvounted.a trimmer, ‘There was no Jikelihood of °
the introduction of ‘a measnre uf this description, and uuder
these circumstances, was it necessary to come. to this resolu-
tion? o4 ‘ .
Mr, BYRNE, of Lisnawilly, moved as an amendment to Mr,
Lawless’s motion, that the ieeting should proceed to the order
-of the day.
_Mr. OpPwyER seeonded the amendment, and congratulated
his ascetic friend, Mr. Lawless, upon the amiable orthodoxy
which he had evinced, Many men, ke (Mr. O’D.) was aware -
had, in point of practice, in the way of-devotion, the advantage -
of Mr. Lawless, but this act of chivalrous piety wrote him down .
in theory a very Papist, and tn the words of Cymbeline, he (Mr.
O'D.) would say :— .
“Iseo you have some religion in yon that you fear!” Canghter.)
Bat to be serious, what could have induced. Mr. Lawless {o
bring forward such a motion—a motion so calculated to do
harm. In point of fact, no man could doubt that any connec- :
tion between the Catholic Clergy and the Government, no nat
ter how arranged, would be a deplorable event, if it produced .
that was irresistible, that no man should be taxed to support a”,
faith inthe efficacy of which he was nota believer. But where...
was the occasion, at this moment, of a body of laymen obtru:
sively rushing into concerns which did not belong to them ;* at
least in the absence of any good cause to warrant their obtre.
sion, and thus risk the hazard of offending the Catholic Cler ¥
for the mere indulgence of asserting an abstract prineipie
which no man attempted to deny. (Eear, hear.) Had the
Catholic Clergy of freland exhibited any signs of corruption
or did their purity require the vigilance of Mr, Lawless’ motion? ~
Was the Government meditating any provision for the Clergy;
and if such a measure were not in contemplation, why remind :
some speculator in our disunion, who could discern in the pro-
ject of an offer to the Catholic Clergy the seeds of disunion
amongst ourselves, that Ly finging such a topic into our de.
bates he might distract our councils? Who could doubt the:
discretion and the parity of the Catholic Clergy of Ireland?
Who have excited the indignant virtue of the people toa great
moral mutiny against the tyrannical oppression under which, .
for years, they had prostrated themselves 7 Who have just :
led the electors of Ireland against the enemy, and won a blood.
evoved that consuiniag spirit of freedom, that is now striding
with gigantic paces upon the ruins of monopoly and corruption,
which are crushed and ovetwhelmed in defeat—a spirit that
must ‘soon regenerate this country, leaving as it does in its .
progress a moral illumination too bright and dazzling for the -
gaze of the public enemy 2? Why, the Catholic Clergy have
lone all this, and are we to lecture. them on their duty; and
where their silence, and the inaction of the Legislature, prove -
that no project, such as glides across the vision of Mr. Law less,
is intended, shall we gratuitously adopt a resolution which can .
do no: good, and by possibility may do harm! (Cheers,)—
the Government? Is it in the indignities which i
lious oficial inflicts upod their feelings? Is it in the crpadcs
that are now mar¢hed against theni in distutbance of the pub: .
lic peace, although under the protection of the magistrac t ts
it ia the conciliatory and ‘kindly disposition evinced Mh : .
who would be choseui to bring forward such a measure for the
adoption of the Legislature? If gentlemen think 80, let th nt
lock ta the correspondence between Mr. Plunkett wind bi G aed
the Catholic Archbishop of Dublin, and discover if, he mode
of address by Mr, Plunkett; there be mich reason to hope fer.
extraordiuary affection between the patties. It is Golie amuse
jug to remark’ the “orthodusy,of certain fa men The
Bishop of Norwich shares his episcopal dignities wath the Ca.
tholic Prelates of fretand, and would wot descend. ih addressin, $
one of those gentlemen, to plunder hint of that spirittal dis. :
tinction whicli his rank in the Charch, aud the courtesies of
ment, that she Clergy agreed to gome pecuniary atrangenient,
well bred society, confet Gpon hia,’ Lord Lansdowne is e§uals .
I respectfal ic bis demeaneur; but Mr, Liab di only Gou,
no other effect than to rob the public advocate of the argument
fess victory over the ascendancy of Orangeism? | Who have <
Where are the symptoms of contact between the Clergy and ,
‘ Ss. '
‘